[Artemisia] An Open Letter Re: Ibrahim and Ileana and the Boa rd
of Directors
Jeff Brainard
marcocaprioli at yahoo.com
Thu Aug 4 15:13:49 CDT 2005
having a sizeable knowledge of the issue, i solidly agree. this is
dirty chess.
marco
--- Sondra Gibson <sgibson at edulog.com> wrote:
> Based on what I know about this issue, I strongly agree with Sir
> Daniel.
>
> Baroness Gefjon Hrafnardottir, OL
> Barony of Sentinels's Keep, Artemisia
>
> > Subject: [Artemisia] An Open Letter Re: Ibrahim and Ileana
> > and the Board
> > of Directors
> >
> >
> > An Open Letter Re: Ibrahim and Ileana and the Board of
> > Directors (ver 1.0)
> > Greetings,
> >
> > My name is Sir Daniel d'Antioche (once known as Thegn Sir Dan
> > Halfhand-Second Baron of Sentinels Keep)
> > At the Third Quarter of 2005 meeting of the SCA Board of
> > directors we have
> > heard that the following business did occur:
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Executive Session
> > Kingdom of the Outlands Request for Sanction of Previous Crown
> > By consensus, Chairman Williams directed the Society
> > Seneschal to begin an
> > investigation into possible violations of Outlands Kingdom
> > traditions and
> > customs by Ibrahim and Ileana as Sovereign and Consort of the
> > Outlands,
> > pursuant to the request of Hoegaarden and Chiara, King and
> > Queen of the
> > Outlands.
> > Chairman Williams further directed that the minutes reflect
> > that the Board
> > recognizes the challenging position of Their Majesties
> > Hoegaarden and Chiara
> > in this matter, and commends Their actions in bringing it forward.
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> > Upon reading this, I was quite shocked. I have known Duke
> > Ibrahim since he
> > was 15. I was at his first fighters practice, and watched him
> > from afar over
> > the years after I moved to An Tir. Although we were not close
> > friends, I
> > have always like and admired him and his brother, and have
> > been very pleased
> > to see him mature into the man and the knight he has become
> > within the SCA.
> >
> > Understand, that since this has been sent up to the BoD, it
> > is no longer
> > just an Outlands issue. Any decision rendered on this case
> > will have far
> > reaching ramifications beyond the Kingdom of the Outlands,
> > and once again,
> > we may see possible further broadening of the powers and
> > authority that the
> > BoD has continued to invest in itself.
> >
> > Upon reading the above missive, I set out to establish the
> > facts around the
> > incident that gave rise to the situation. Below I have listed them
> > categorized as Facts, Informed Opinions, Unanswered
> > Questions, and Personal
> > Conjecture.
> >
> >
> > Facts:
> >
> > 1-Just before stepping down as the Crown of the Outlands,
> > Ibrahim and Ileana
> > conducted a ceremony for one Duke Lycurgus to re-invest him
> > with Knighthood.
> >
> > 2-At that Ceremony, the then-Crown Prince, Hoegaarden, was
> > the person who
> > went out into the audience to escort Duke Lycurgus before
> > TRM's for his
> > ceremony.
> >
> > 3- Duke Lycurgus, sometime after an incident at Estrella War in
> 2001,
> > submitted a letter to the BoD relinquishing his Knighthood.
> > On 7/2101 an
> > investigation was launched, and on Oct 20 01 he was
> > sanctioned for 2 years
> > from date. (No mention that I can find that the BoD
> > officially recognized
> > him giving up his belt-but I could be wrong)
> >
> > 4- The relevant Outlands Law regarding this issue are as
> > follows: (from
> > http://www.outlands.org/Library/lawweb.html)
> >
> > E. The Crown shall confer awards upon individuals. Only
> > members of the
> > S.C.A. may receive armigerous awards. No award, whether
> > armigerous or not,
> > may be conferred upon a subject of any realm outside the
> > Kingdom of the
> > Outlands without the prior written consent of the Crown to whom the
>
> > individual is subject.
> > I. The Crown sets the Order of the March for their Courts
> > and for Kingdom
> > events.
> >
> > 5- The Relevant Society rules regarding this issue are as
> > follows: (from
> > http://www.sca.org/docs/govdocs.pdf )
> >
> > I. GENERAL C. Role of the Board 2. Relationship with branches -
> > The Board will maintain a policy of non-interference with
> > branch activities.
> > The Board reserves the right to intervene in branch affairs if:
> > a) The events leading to such intervention appear to cause a
> > threat to the
> > integrity of the Society or the SCA, Inc.;
> > b) The governing documents of the Society appear to have been
> > violated;
> > c) There is a threat to the SCA's legal standing; or
> > d) The Board is asked to become involved.
> >
> > 6- Meg Baron (recently retired President of the SCA) Lives in
> > the Outlands.
> >
> > 7- It is a long recognized process that giving out Peerages
> > is a decision
> > made at the Kingdom level.
> >
> > Informed Opinions:
> >
> > 1-There is a group of Peers and populace in Outlands that are
> > unhappy with
> > the re-Knighting.
> >
> > 2- There is a smaller group of Peers and populace that are
> > happy with the
> > re-Knighting
> >
> > 2-Meg Baron is among the Peers who are unhappy
> >
> > 3-Ibrahim and Ileana are in trouble for violating the
> > 'traditions' of the
> > Outlands, *not* Kingdom Law and *certainly not* Mundane Law.
> >
> > 4-These 'traditions' are not written anywhere that I've been
> > able to find
> > online.
> >
> > 5-Although many people I've spoken to claim that the Outlands
> > is a 'The
> > Kings Word is Law' Kingdom, that phrase does not appear in
> > Outlands Kingdom
> > Law, unlike many other Kingdoms in the SCA.
> >
> > 6- Duke Lycurgus's name was discussed inconclusively with
> > many Crowns since
> > he gave up his belt in 2001. This includes many discussions
> > both public and
> > private with Ibrahim while he was King.
> >
> > 7-One of the people who was in favor of the re-knighting
> > before the fact was
> > the Current Crown of the Outlands Hoegaarden.
> >
> >
> > Unanswered Questions:
> >
> > 1-While I have been able to determine that Duke Lycurgus did
> > send in a
> > letter relinquishing his belt to the BoD, I have been unable
> > to determine
> > from the minutes (that I've been able to find) what, if any,
> > action the BoD
> > took at that time other than the Sanction listed above.
> > Anyone with actual
> > facts regarding this issue is encouraged to send them forward
> > to me. It is
> > likely his request was accepted, but, if for some reason the
> > BoD did not
> > take action on this issue, then by the letter of the law this
> entire
> > situation and point is moot since that would mean Duke
> > Lycurgus was never
> > properly degraded by the BoD in 2001.
> >
> > 2-It is VERY possible that any ruling regarding this issue
> > will restrict ALL
> > other future Crowns from making peers as they see fit.
> > According to the
> > Governing Documents any ruling by the BoD applies across the
> > board to *all*
> > Kingdoms. If Ibrahim and Ileana are sanctioned for this
> > action, then will
> > we require Peerage Council approval and consent for all
> > future Peerages in
> > ALL Kingdoms?
> >
> > 3- How is it that the current Crown pushed for Duke Lycurgus
> > to get his belt
> > back but then sends up Ibrahim and Ileana to the BoD for
> > discipline for an
> > act that he himself championed?
> >
> > 4-Why is it that the Outlands seems to be so willing to send
> > up internal
> > matters up to the BoD that would be handled internally at the
> > Kingdom level
> > by so many other Kingdoms?
> >
> > 5- Is the above question related to the fact that the
> > President of the SCA
> > lived in the Outlands during this incident?
> >
> >
> > Personal Conjecture:
> >
> > Ibrahim and Ileana are possibly about to become collateral
> > damage in a fight
> > that is actually aimed at re-stripping Duke Lycurgus of his
> > belt. In order
> > to get that belt, first they have to go after the Crown that
> > gave it to him.
> > Another casualty in this fight will be future Crowns'
> > heretofore (in many
> > Kingdoms ABSOLUTE) held right to be the final judge on who
> > gets peerages and
> > who doesn't.
> >
> > It is also become increasingly clear that the BoD, although
> > they claim to be
> > hesitant to get involved with local issues, has no
> > compunction whatsoever
> > into wading into local medieval issues that are far beyond
> > the scope of
> > their original mandate:
> >
> > "The Board is the final court of appeal for disputes that
> > have escalated
> > beyond the ability of the participants or the officers to
> > handle. However,
> > it is reluctant to play that role because its rulings affect
> > the entire
> > Society - often by restricting everyone's freedom and reducing
> their
> > enjoyment of the organization. Corpora provides an unlimited
> > right of appeal
> > to the Board, but members should make every effort to work out
> their
> > disputes at as low a level in the organization as possible. "
> > How is the BoD being 'RELUCTANT" when they repeatedly and
> > actively pressure
> > Crowns into sending up charges in order to give the BoD the
> > opportunity to
> > intervene in local issues?
> >
> > I would invite anyone who has any more actual factual
> > information to send
> > this to me and I will be happy to revise this list. I realize
> > that since
> > these actions mostly took place nearly halfway across the
> > continent that I
> > have had to rely on second hand information. If any of the
> > above points are
> > incorrect please let me know. It is not my intention to
> > spread incorrect
> > information regarding this or any other issue.
> >
> > I am sending this open letter out to many different public
> > areas, but I am
> > also cc'ing it to each and ever member of the BoD at
> > directors at sca.org and
> > would encourage you to do the same. It is important to speak
> > out if you feel
> > as strongly about this as I do, or feel it's important that
> > the BoD hears
> > other voices outside the corporate echo chamber on this issue.
> >
> > To be clear, the objective of this letter is to encourage the
> > BoD to NOT get
> > involved in this local Kingdom matter. Secondarily the
> > objective is to
> > encourage other 'members' of the SCA to also publicly
> > encourage the BoD to
> > stay out of the medieval side of OUR game.
> >
> > Permission is not only give but encouraged to re-print or
> > forward this
> > letter ONLY in its entirety anywhere by anyone, anytime.
> >
> > In Service,
> >
> > Sir Daniel d'Antioche
> >
> >
> > Cc:
> > directors at sca.org
> > Outlands List
> > Known World Chivalry list
> > Various An Tir Lists
> > Artemisia List
> > Kingdom of the East list
> > (possibly others as I think of them)
> > _______________________________________________
> > Artemisia mailing list
> > Artemisia at lists.gallowglass.org
> > http://lists.gallowglass.org/mailman/listinfo/artemisia
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Artemisia mailing list
> Artemisia at lists.gallowglass.org
> http://lists.gallowglass.org/mailman/listinfo/artemisia
>
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