[Artemisia] Yay for Good TV! :D

[Tamar Black Sea]

Gefjon wrote:
"They sound like they have nothing to do with historical re-creation, 
and are only interested in smashing each other off of horses. "

I agree that The Knights of Mayhem came off as very macho and bad-a**; 
however, as far as historical accuracy goes, wasn't the whole point of 
jousting to kill or injure the enemy to the point where they were no 
longer a threat? Jousting was, and is a martial art. It's roots are in 
war and heavy cavalry training.  As far as being historically correct, 
jousting to un-horse an opponent is more representative of what you 
would see in war or in medieval tournaments than the jousting we do in 
the SCA.  The concessions our medieval counterparts made to the health 
and well-being of tournament participants would not be acceptable by 
today's standards. One of many examples of the brutality of medieval 
jousting is the fact the France discontinued jousting when King Henry II 
was mortally injured during a joust.

As for "knightly qualities", as far as I'm aware, historical knights 
(defined here as members of the cavalry), intended to kill their 
enemies. It wasn't nice, or pretty, it was war. Going back to the time 
of Xenophon (and  earlier), mounted warriors were used in war because 
they could move faster than foot soldiers and do a heck of a lot of 
damage when utilized effectively by their commander.

I guess what I'm saying is that I respectfully disagree with the 
conclusion that the Knights of Mayhem have nothing to do with historical 
re-creation. In the middle ages, different tournaments, in different 
eras, had their own sets of rules about how jousting would be conducted. 
Not every tournament was set up with the "un-horsing" style of jousting, 
but many did, indeed, have un-horsing as a goal. Jousting to un-horse an 
opponent is brutal and dangerous.....and very historical.

One interesting bit of trivia is that, to this day, "tilting" is the 
official sport of the state of Maryland. (I think they might mean 
tilting at rings here; but the martial origins remain the same.)

Having said all this, I personally wouldn't want to do the un-horsing 
kind of jousting. As I've gotten older, I've discovered that I no longer 
"bounce" the way I did when I was younger. It REALLY HURTS to fall of a 
horse. It's no fun. I like SCA-style jousting just fine :-), but if the 
Knights of Mayhem want to get the crap knocked out of them, I say, more 
power to 'em.

-tamar



On 11/15/2011 4:01 PM, Sondra Gibson wrote:
>   >  Subject: [Artemisia] Yay for Good TV! :D
>> Knights of Mayhem will be premiering tonight, thanks to
>> National Geographic. It starts, I believe, at 7pm, and there
>> is a second episode right after.
>
>   Wow - I had thought about posting about that group and seeing what others thought.  Not to be a spoil sport but I saw a documentary that was partly about them a while back and have seen numerous previews of the upcoming Nat. Geo show.  I was not amused.  They sound like they have nothing to do with historical re-creation, and are only interested in smashing each other off of horses. (wanting to get jousting to be an olympic sport???) One big guy was saying that anyone who faced him should plan on eventually being hurt.  He really seemed to have an 'attitude'.  Not anything I'd compare to knightly qualities.  Sorry but I think it puts jousting in a *very* bad light.
>
> There is another group out there whose name escapes me that appears to be MUCH more into doing things historically correct and seem to care much more about safety. I wonder how many horses the knights of mayhem have injured?  Don't really care about the people - I figure they are going into it with full knowledge of the danger.  But the poor horses....
>
> Just my 50c worth...
>
> Gefjon
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